Ben Boyer: 00:00:11

it's kind of like your first job.

Ben Boyer: 00:00:12

You know, everybody has to have a first job.

Ben Boyer: 00:00:14

Everybody has to have a first financial product to develop a credit history.

Ben Boyer: 00:00:18

that's ultimately where people are going to be successful in the space

Tedd Huff: 00:00:22

the idea of the DDA, not being that primary driver of that relationship.

Tedd Huff: 00:00:30

really Make it.

Tedd Huff: 00:00:31

A lifetime customer not I need it now type customer.

Ben Boyer: 00:00:35

we've been around since 1962,

Ben Boyer: 00:00:37

obviously in the past five, 10 years,

Ben Boyer: 00:00:39

more alternative data coming in and more opportunity to understand

Ben Boyer: 00:00:43

your customer base

Ben Boyer: 00:00:44

It's really about finding the people that are falling through the cracks.

Ben Boyer: 00:00:49

products have gotten into a little bit of regulatory hot water,

Ben Boyer: 00:00:51

is just around over promising and under delivering with what they can do

Ben Boyer: 00:00:55

companies that are

Ben Boyer: 00:00:55

maybe viewing that as a major profit center.

Ben Boyer: 00:00:59

Are approaching it the wrong way

Ben Boyer: 00:01:01

exceptional customer service and continuing to offer them products

Ben Boyer: 00:01:04

that meet them where they are

Ben Boyer: 00:01:06

they were there for me when nobody else was

Tedd Huff: 00:01:08

Here's a quick message from the Accrued Series sponsor.

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Tedd Huff: 00:01:41

Welcome to Accrued, the fintech confidential series presented by LoanPro.

Tedd Huff: 00:01:47

In this series, we're deconstructing the complexities of lending and exploring

Tedd Huff: 00:01:51

compliance, optimization, modernization, and personalization through insightful

Tedd Huff: 00:01:56

conversations with the industry's

Tedd Huff: 00:01:58

best.

Tedd Huff: 00:01:59

I'm Tedd Huff, and with my co host Colton Pond, we'll be guiding you

Tedd Huff: 00:02:03

through the intricate lending world.

Tedd Huff: 00:02:05

Whether you're deep into lend tech or just intrigued by how the

Tedd Huff: 00:02:09

technology is reshaping lending.

Tedd Huff: 00:02:11

You're in the right place.

Tedd Huff: 00:02:13

And now let's dive into another episode Of accrued.

Tedd Huff: 00:02:18

Colton, this, we're out here on the salt flats at the

Tedd Huff: 00:02:22

strategic advisory board event.

Tedd Huff: 00:02:25

I don't think I've ever done a podcast in an environment like this

Tedd Huff: 00:02:29

before, but I'm super stoked to be sitting down with Ben Boyer today

Tedd Huff: 00:02:32

to see what's going on in his world.

Colton Pond: 00:02:35

Yeah, let's let's dig in Ben, so to have you, Ben leads a new

Colton Pond: 00:02:39

product development at world acceptance, um, and excited to have you here.

Colton Pond: 00:02:43

Welcome, man.

Colton Pond: 00:02:43

Excited

Ben Boyer: 00:02:43

to be here.

Ben Boyer: 00:02:44

Thanks for having me.

Colton Pond: 00:02:45

Yeah,

Tedd Huff: 00:02:45

I want to start off by just understanding from your perspective,

Tedd Huff: 00:02:49

you guys have been in the business of, uh, Providing installment loans.

Tedd Huff: 00:02:54

What are you seeing the market doing and how is that impacting the way that you're

Tedd Huff: 00:03:00

looking at moving the business forward?

Ben Boyer: 00:03:03

Yeah.

Ben Boyer: 00:03:03

So I think, you know, we've been around since 1962, um, we've been

Ben Boyer: 00:03:06

doing installment loan lending.

Ben Boyer: 00:03:08

So I think we've really kind of focused on what I think are key.

Ben Boyer: 00:03:12

Principles are, which is how can we help our customers and how can

Ben Boyer: 00:03:16

we provide them with the financial services that they need for wherever

Ben Boyer: 00:03:19

they are on their financial journey?

Ben Boyer: 00:03:22

And so I think throughout time, you know, obviously since the sixties, there's

Ben Boyer: 00:03:25

been, boom periods and there's been bust periods and there've been plenty of

Ben Boyer: 00:03:28

companies that have come and gone, but I think we've really just tried to focus

Ben Boyer: 00:03:31

on how can we help serve our customers and how can we give them what they need?

Ben Boyer: 00:03:37

And if we can do that, we're ultimately going to be successful.

Ben Boyer: 00:03:40

Regardless of what the economic climate is.

Colton Pond: 00:03:42

Yeah.

Colton Pond: 00:03:42

So one of the key themes on that note, Ben, and we've chatted a good

Colton Pond: 00:03:45

amount here at strategic advisory board is the shift from organizations

Colton Pond: 00:03:50

on offering one product to expanding.

Colton Pond: 00:03:53

And as we mentioned, you lead new product development.

Colton Pond: 00:03:56

Help us understand as you think about new product opportunities.

Colton Pond: 00:04:00

How do you prioritize what to go after and what that looks like?

Ben Boyer: 00:04:03

I think it's really about putting yourself in the customer's shoes

Ben Boyer: 00:04:07

and asking yourself, what did they need?

Ben Boyer: 00:04:08

You know, it's easy for us to sit in meeting rooms and try to whiteboard out

Ben Boyer: 00:04:12

all these products that we could come up with that, that we think would be cool.

Ben Boyer: 00:04:16

But you know, we're not always the customers that can serve them, so we

Ben Boyer: 00:04:19

really have to put ourselves in the customer's shoes and say, What do our

Ben Boyer: 00:04:22

customers need when they walk into a branch or when they come into a website?

Ben Boyer: 00:04:26

What are they looking at us to be able to help serve them with?

Ben Boyer: 00:04:29

And how can we expand upon that to, to really help them

Ben Boyer: 00:04:33

grow their financial future?

Colton Pond: 00:04:35

Yeah, and what's the job to be done, right?

Colton Pond: 00:04:37

Like, what jobs and pain points do they have?

Colton Pond: 00:04:39

What do they need us to solve?

Colton Pond: 00:04:41

And what I love about the shift from being a lot of organizations, uh, one

Colton Pond: 00:04:46

product to multi product and increasing share wallet is exactly what you said.

Colton Pond: 00:04:50

If you can better serve the needs of the consumer, that's good for

Colton Pond: 00:04:53

everyone, especially the consumer.

Ben Boyer: 00:04:54

Right.

Ben Boyer: 00:04:55

Absolutely.

Tedd Huff: 00:04:55

How are you looking at moving the company forward and, and.

Tedd Huff: 00:05:02

Where is an area you see as an opportunity,

Tedd Huff: 00:05:04

for the market to serve your customers better?

Ben Boyer: 00:05:06

Yeah.

Ben Boyer: 00:05:07

So I think for us, it's about.

Ben Boyer: 00:05:09

You know having products that cater to our customers as they continue to progress up

Ben Boyer: 00:05:14

the financial journey that they're on so

Ben Boyer: 00:05:18

Really looking to how can we start with a customer who maybe has a

Ben Boyer: 00:05:21

really really thin file Or you know have some major derogatories on

Ben Boyer: 00:05:24

their credit report and how can we continue to offer them products?

Ben Boyer: 00:05:28

They're going to be appealing to them and are going to be competitive with

Ben Boyer: 00:05:30

what they could get in the market right there because once we have a

Ben Boyer: 00:05:32

customer who's demonstrated that they have the capability to pay and be a

Ben Boyer: 00:05:36

good customer, we don't want to lose them to somebody else who's going to

Ben Boyer: 00:05:40

offer them a product that we can't.

Ben Boyer: 00:05:41

So we want to have, you know, products that will compete and be

Ben Boyer: 00:05:45

good products that they want to have.

Ben Boyer: 00:05:46

I make the cliche joke all the time, you know, we're probably

Ben Boyer: 00:05:49

never going to have airport lounges and be serving the, you know, the

Ben Boyer: 00:05:53

millionaires and the billionaires of the world with super prime offering.

Ben Boyer: 00:05:57

But, you know, we want to be able to have somebody come in, uh, very early

Ben Boyer: 00:06:01

on in their journey and stay with us, know, for, for as long as they want to.

Tedd Huff: 00:06:05

Yeah.

Tedd Huff: 00:06:06

Colton, you know, it's interesting as I hear Ben talk about this is that a lot of

Tedd Huff: 00:06:09

the conversation that we've heard today, with The attendees as well as, the folks

Tedd Huff: 00:06:14

that are sharing their, their knowledge has been the idea of the DDA, not being

Tedd Huff: 00:06:22

that primary driver of that relationship.

Tedd Huff: 00:06:26

And what I'm hearing from Ben is that they're taking that step to continue

Tedd Huff: 00:06:30

to extend that relationship beyond

Tedd Huff: 00:06:33

that installment loan beyond those pieces and really make it.

Tedd Huff: 00:06:37

A lifetime customer not I need it now type customer.

Colton Pond: 00:06:41

I mean, this is a great point and one that's As I pressure tested it

Colton Pond: 00:06:46

with people a relatively controversial topic actually because I personally view

Colton Pond: 00:06:51

my And so my i'll share a little bit about my financial life My direct deposit goes

Colton Pond: 00:06:56

into both us bank and sofi But I actually don't consider my relationship with either

Colton Pond: 00:07:01

of them I consider my primary relationship actually with american express

Tedd Huff: 00:07:04

same here.

Colton Pond: 00:07:05

All my transactions go through american express Sorry, like

Colton Pond: 00:07:09

Airport lounges and things like that.

Colton Pond: 00:07:11

The world doesn't care But they know way more about me than us bank or sofi.

Colton Pond: 00:07:15

They see every single transaction in my life um and along those lines You Um,

Colton Pond: 00:07:21

when we think about, uh, you all world and think about the credit builder has been

Colton Pond: 00:07:26

a hot topic for fintechs for regulation for a variety of different ways.

Colton Pond: 00:07:32

where do you think the future of credit builder and building is going?

Ben Boyer: 00:07:37

where those products have gotten into a little bit of regulatory

Ben Boyer: 00:07:39

hot water, um, or are starting to is just around over promising and under delivering

Ben Boyer: 00:07:45

with what they can do with regards to,

Ben Boyer: 00:07:47

improving a customer's credit, depending on how they come in and also how quickly

Ben Boyer: 00:07:52

they can do it and how much they cost.

Ben Boyer: 00:07:54

And I think a lot of companies that are

Ben Boyer: 00:07:56

maybe viewing that as a major profit center.

Ben Boyer: 00:08:00

Are approaching it the wrong way.

Ben Boyer: 00:08:01

we view those products as introductory products to really get to know

Ben Boyer: 00:08:05

the customer and hopefully grow them into other products that are

Ben Boyer: 00:08:11

gonna have higher profit margins.

Ben Boyer: 00:08:12

But, you know, we view those products as, you know, hopefully

Ben Boyer: 00:08:15

they're not loss leaders.

Ben Boyer: 00:08:16

Hopefully you can break even on them, but we're not looking to generate

Ben Boyer: 00:08:19

massive amounts of revenue off of, you know, really the entry level products.

Ben Boyer: 00:08:22

That's that's really about,

Colton Pond: 00:08:25

How do you make sure that you keep the customer

Colton Pond: 00:08:27

after that first year experience?

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Ben Boyer: 00:09:31

It's really about providing them with exceptional customer service

Ben Boyer: 00:09:34

and continuing to offer them products that meet them where they are on that cycle.

Ben Boyer: 00:09:39

And I think if you can do that, if you can find a way to have

Ben Boyer: 00:09:42

a really good relationship with the customer where they're

Ben Boyer: 00:09:45

not out looking for other financial products, and when

Ben Boyer: 00:09:48

you offer them something,

Ben Boyer: 00:09:49

they say, Hey, I like these guys, I've got a good relationship with them.

Ben Boyer: 00:09:52

they were there for me when nobody else was.

Ben Boyer: 00:09:55

You know, I'll, I'll, I'll keep everything.

Ben Boyer: 00:09:57

You know, it helps if they have their logins and everything already set

Ben Boyer: 00:10:00

up and I don't want to reset those.

Ben Boyer: 00:10:02

It's easier to stay.

Ben Boyer: 00:10:03

Um with who you want to but I think that's really our goal is to to be

Ben Boyer: 00:10:06

the company that you want to stay with

Colton Pond: 00:10:08

and then pricing becomes less of a factor because I know that

Colton Pond: 00:10:11

i've had my Personal loan with world and they've treated me Well when I

Colton Pond: 00:10:16

had a tough time and I I lost my job they were there and helped me through

Colton Pond: 00:10:21

that Uh opportunity rather than saying, yeah Call me when you're 90

Colton Pond: 00:10:24

days delinquent and we'll chat about options, right which is a far different.

Colton Pond: 00:10:27

Uh, Approach.

Colton Pond: 00:10:29

Yep

Tedd Huff: 00:10:30

And Colton, with you talking about being there, and you said meet

Tedd Huff: 00:10:33

them where they're at, what are some of the approaches that you take to make

Tedd Huff: 00:10:38

sure you're there, and you're meeting them where they're at, even if they

Tedd Huff: 00:10:42

don't know that they're there already?

Ben Boyer: 00:10:45

Yeah, I think it's about, you know, understanding the customer,

Ben Boyer: 00:10:48

having interactions with the customer, and to your point, educating the

Ben Boyer: 00:10:52

customer, um, about, you know, You know what things they might be,

Ben Boyer: 00:10:56

able to get it at this point in their financial journey and

Ben Boyer: 00:10:59

what it looks like to get there.

Ben Boyer: 00:11:01

really, when I think about what the future of the, fintech landscape looks

Ben Boyer: 00:11:05

like and product offerings, you know, we were talking and somebody mentioned,

Ben Boyer: 00:11:09

you know, this is a frustration that I know I had for a really long time is, you

Ben Boyer: 00:11:11

know, there's not really a good budgeting app that says if I have 100 in my bank

Ben Boyer: 00:11:17

account and I get paid X amount every two weeks, and I have these expenses

Ben Boyer: 00:11:21

like Am I going to run out of money?

Ben Boyer: 00:11:23

If so, when, how much money do I need?

Ben Boyer: 00:11:25

You know, if I add in this additional thing, what's that

Ben Boyer: 00:11:27

going to do to the budget?

Ben Boyer: 00:11:28

So I think people that can deliver that type of education and common

Ben Boyer: 00:11:33

sense conversation to the customer to say, Hey, this is what it looks like.

Ben Boyer: 00:11:38

This is what you need to do.

Ben Boyer: 00:11:40

Here's how you can get there.

Ben Boyer: 00:11:41

And yes, you, you can do this.

Ben Boyer: 00:11:43

You can be control in control of your financial future and you can succeed.

Ben Boyer: 00:11:47

the people who can tie those conversations into the right products for those

Ben Boyer: 00:11:51

customers are the ones that are ultimately going to succeed and win.

Colton Pond: 00:11:54

Yeah.

Colton Pond: 00:11:54

Lastly, on that note, uh, key aspect there is understanding the customer

Colton Pond: 00:11:59

through the data that you have and offering personalized products

Colton Pond: 00:12:02

to meet them where they're at.

Colton Pond: 00:12:03

And that's a lot as we've met Ben that I've seen through Uh, you've

Colton Pond: 00:12:06

been able to do and go on the journey of, Hey, where are my customers

Colton Pond: 00:12:09

and how else can I help them?

Colton Pond: 00:12:11

Right.

Colton Pond: 00:12:11

Um, and how can I help them on the journey to what they want to achieve?

Colton Pond: 00:12:15

'cause ultimately every consumer doesn't wanna be in debt.

Colton Pond: 00:12:19

and in the end, lenders need to.

Colton Pond: 00:12:20

Help customers fulfill their goals, which is to get out of debt, right?

Tedd Huff: 00:12:24

one last question Okay, because it's been as you and I were walking over

Tedd Huff: 00:12:28

You know, I I was kind of at i've asking a couple questions to better understand

Tedd Huff: 00:12:32

where you guys were at and I think the the piece that that was brought up is

Tedd Huff: 00:12:37

Is the credit worthiness piece of it?

Tedd Huff: 00:12:40

And I want to know from your perspective How do you see?

Tedd Huff: 00:12:47

The way we evaluate.

Tedd Huff: 00:12:49

That worthiness, especially for the upcoming products

Tedd Huff: 00:12:52

that you all are working on,

Tedd Huff: 00:12:54

how has that changed and or changing in the next couple of years.

Ben Boyer: 00:12:59

it's changed a lot, you know, obviously in the past five,

Ben Boyer: 00:13:02

10 years, um, with, you know, more alternative data coming in and more

Ben Boyer: 00:13:06

opportunity to understand it, know more about your customer base, um, through,

Ben Boyer: 00:13:11

you know, platforms like finicity and plaid and, and those types of things.

Ben Boyer: 00:13:15

And I think that's the direction that it's ultimately.

Ben Boyer: 00:13:17

Going to continue to go in and, and the more information you can get about your

Ben Boyer: 00:13:23

customer's behavior and spending habits and patterns for things, and the more

Ben Boyer: 00:13:29

complete picture you can form about your customer without having to be.

Ben Boyer: 00:13:33

Entirely reliant on a backwards looking credit score.

Ben Boyer: 00:13:37

Um, that's always going to be a trailing indicator, which obviously

Ben Boyer: 00:13:40

those are fantastic products and they've served the market for really,

Ben Boyer: 00:13:42

really long time, but everybody has access to the same credit scores and

Ben Boyer: 00:13:46

everybody knows what everybody else is targeting from an underwriting model.

Ben Boyer: 00:13:49

So it's really about finding the people that are falling through the cracks.

Ben Boyer: 00:13:53

Of the large organizations that they just don't care about figuring out

Ben Boyer: 00:13:57

how to, find the right customers out of those populations and

Ben Boyer: 00:14:01

serve them with quality products.

Colton Pond: 00:14:03

One of the aspects, a final thought on one of the conversations I had

Colton Pond: 00:14:07

today, if you think about FICO score, it is one score for the broader population,

Colton Pond: 00:14:12

and it's actually done a pretty damn good job at being relatively representative.

Colton Pond: 00:14:16

When you say, this is a score for everyone, everyone it works, right?

Colton Pond: 00:14:21

Right.

Colton Pond: 00:14:21

Uh, but where I see differentiation, what you're talking about is how do you

Colton Pond: 00:14:25

take segments of the overall population and even your customer base and find

Colton Pond: 00:14:32

alternative data that helps better inform creditworthiness, ability and

Colton Pond: 00:14:37

willingness to repay and what, uh, portfolio performance would look like.

Ben Boyer: 00:14:42

Yeah.

Ben Boyer: 00:14:42

And how do you find low risk products that creditworthiness is even less of a factor?

Ben Boyer: 00:14:47

How do you give the customer base that has.

Ben Boyer: 00:14:50

No credit history whatsoever.

Ben Boyer: 00:14:51

The opportunity to prove themselves.

Ben Boyer: 00:14:53

You know, it's kind of like your first job.

Ben Boyer: 00:14:54

You know, everybody has to have a first job.

Ben Boyer: 00:14:56

Everybody has to have a first financial product to develop a credit history.

Ben Boyer: 00:15:00

And how do you come out with products that can meet those customers while

Ben Boyer: 00:15:05

also not generating a tremendous amount of risk for your company?

Ben Boyer: 00:15:08

I think that's ultimately where people are going to be successful in the space.

Ben Boyer: 00:15:12

And we're hoping to be successful in the spaces is don't over

Ben Boyer: 00:15:14

promise and under deliver.

Ben Boyer: 00:15:16

And, you know, be honest and upfront with your customers and help them.

Ben Boyer: 00:15:19

I mean, that's, that's what we're all in the business to do.

Ben Boyer: 00:15:22

And there's been a lot of conversation about that here at this meeting is,

Ben Boyer: 00:15:25

you know, we're all in this business to help our customers and serve them.

Ben Boyer: 00:15:29

if you lose sight of that, you can get yourself in trouble.

Ben Boyer: 00:15:32

And so my hope is that we can just make sure that we never lose sight of that.

Colton Pond: 00:15:34

I agree.

Colton Pond: 00:15:36

Thanks for the time, Ben.

Colton Pond: 00:15:36

Really appreciate it.

Colton Pond: 00:15:37

Thanks.

Tedd Huff: 00:15:38

Well folks, that does it for another episode of Accrued.

Tedd Huff: 00:15:41

If you've made it this far, go ahead, like, share,

Tedd Huff: 00:15:43

subscribe, all that fun stuff.

Tedd Huff: 00:15:44

And don't forget to sign up at fintechconfidential.

Tedd Huff: 00:15:48

com to be alerted your favorite episode coming up next.

Tedd Huff: 00:15:53

And as always, keep moving forward.